Thermal paste and mounting of new cpu cooler

[Michael]

Hi

Thank you for the very enlightening article.

"The HardwareLogic Thermal Compound Round-Up - Our Recommendation"

After reading I think that I have got a problem

And I would be happy for help with this qestion:

I just bought a Scythe Ninja Mini CPU Cooler. I bought it because of the good specifications and reviews, but also because it has socket 754 brackets and should be compatible with my ASUS K8V deluxe motherboard.

But unfortunately, the brackets are made with only three setting for the size of the gap between the cpu and the bottom of the cooler. And the No 1 position is too tight, for the brackets to lock in place. So I had to use the No. 2 position. And that is rather loose.

I thought then that the philosophy was that the thermal paste (that came with the cooler) should keep the bottom of the cooler and the cpu together due to a vacuum effect. It actually appeared to do so. But at a time when I moved around with something inside the computer (I moved the cooler fan) one of the brackets lost its grip and the cooler lost its contact with the cpu. I hurried to replace it and the cooler again sticked to the cpu.

Now I wonder if that could have affected the cooling.

For further information: I have set the motherboard to qool-and-quiet. 5 minutes after the boot-up the cooler fan stops because of low cpu-temperature. But 10 minutes after it starts up again the temperature rises and stays on a little below nearly max rpm because of the temperature rising – even when the pc is idle. I belive that I have checked for all other cooling determinants

The cpu is AMD 64 Athlon 3200+ and use much power I believe, but I still wonder

I would be happy for some advice.


Yours hopefully

[gvblake22]

Can you run a program like CoreTemp to quantify what your temps actually are?
The different mounting brackets for the Scythe Ninja Mini are only for compatibility with different processor sockets, not for different mounting pressure. You should only be able to install this heatsink on an AMD s754 system with one of the retention brackets, the one with only two large clips (one on each side).
<<picture link>>

The amount of force needed to press the clips down around the socket retention bracket can sometimes be more than you would expect, so it sounds like you were doing it correct the first time but just didn't push hard enough. However you clipped it on the second time that caused it to fall off is likely not correct and you should not try and run your computer until you are sure you have the heatsink mounted correctly.

You should be able to clip the Ninja Mini's mounting bracket over the middle notches on the retention bracket screwed to the motherboard. Use the notches that line up with the screw holes...
<<picture link>>

[Michael]

Thank you so much. That is very helpfull. I think that you are right, I should try to mount the brackets - yes I use the correct ones - with more pressure. Perhaps I should use a screwdriver to twist the brackets over the middle nodges of the retention brackets?

I guess I will do that first thing. Then I guess I should buy some cleaningfluid and new paste and reasemble using that when I get it. Because I just placed the paste from the cooler on top of the old (stemming from the all-in-a-box heatsink) not nowing, that I should not do that - but just read, that it is wrong.

Thank you very much again

Right now I have been using the PC for 15 minutes - only writing this - and the core temperature is 56 C. Thanks for the link to CoreTemp. And for the picture links. (The first one I am not abble to open thou - I get "403 Error-Forbidden")

[gvblake22]

Hmmm, not sure why that first picture link isn't working anymore, sorry. The picture came from this review, it is the third picture down, showing the AMD retention bracket on the base of the Ninja Mini.
You definitely want to make it a habit to thoroughly clean the processor and heatsink with at least 90% isopropyl alcohol. You shouldn't need to apply a lot of Thermal Interface Material (TIM) either, a pea sized blob in the middle of the processor IHS should do it.

Be very careful using a screwdriver though, you can easily slip off and jam it into the motherboard, possibly cutting some traces and killing the motherboard. By the look of the retention brackets on the Ninja Mini, you can probably just use your thumb and push down. If you need to use a tool, try a wooden cooking spoon or something that is relatively soft and won't break the motherboard if you slip.

56 C is a bit warm, but you shouldn't have a meltdown. I try not to let my processors get over about 50 C, so that should be your focus. Be sure to post back here if you've got any questions though, I would hate to see you fry your processor because you messed up the heatsink installation.

[Michael]

Thankyou again for letting me draw on your experience - especially your warning about the screwdriver. That could easily have been a disaster - I realise now.

And thanks for your kind invitation to let me ask again.

I have now checked the heatsinkinstallation once more. It is not posible at all I believe to use the default position of the brackets (They have 3 steps and the default is the most tight) - I call it "#1". But I mounted it again with step #2 (the middle on). This time I checked the tightness again. And I found, that it is not so loose, as I first thought - and wrote to you the first time.

With the cooler mounted that way I can slide it a little if I use little power - perhaps it is ok, whith those type og brackets? And only if I use pretty musch strength I am able to make the cooler slip the cpu a little. So perhaps it is ok?

Furthermore I started off removing some of the paste to make sure to have the best chances to clip on the cooler as tight as possible.

Now I have assembled the computer again. Coretemp now reports 62 C - (and sure is a good program to have - because the ASUS Motherboard Probe-program reports 53 C). I started off the testing by opening the bios program - and the temp rose to above 54 C and after that instead of a temperatur figure I got the message "Ignored" - I was not able to reproduce it thou.

So I have been online buying the one of the best recommended TIM, that I can get here. I will follow your good adwice on cleaning the surfaces first and on how to use the TIM.

I hope that works.

I have furthermore manipulated all that I could with my sleeved wires and rounded bus cables to create the best air flow possibilies. And I have mounted ingoing and and outgoing cabine fans (2).

So if this does not help I think theres is nothing else to do, than to give up the Ninja Mini. Because there is not much room in the midi tower cabinet and it is pretty tight packed.

But I hope it works.

And I would be happy to report back to you.

Thankyou for all your help so far.

Michael

[gvblake22]

First off, it sounds like you've got the cooler mounted correctly now. It usually does have a little sliding room, but it should be less than a centimeter. You should definitely clean the whole thing and start over with your TIM application, that will help. As for the temperatures, they are getting pretty high, which makes me wonder if you have a fan mounted on the Ninja Mini. It is a relatively small heatsink compared to the full sized Ninja, so I suggest mounting at least an 80mm fan on the side of it to blow through the fins.

[Michael]

Thankyou very much - good to know, that I have got the mounting right.

So next thing is to work with the TIM.

And thankyou for making shure, that I have my attention on the fan necessity. Yes I have a fan mounted on the cooler - the original 80mm one that came with the MiniNinja. The Cool'n'Quit drives it at full speed pushing air through the fins. I also have a 120mm cabin fan right on the other side pulling air out from the fins and out of the back of the cabin (and I have 120mm fan in the front too, pushing air into the cabin). But the big question is if the miditower is to small (I really wanted to buy the big Ninja, but it is to high for the cabin) and therefore too crowded.

The pushing fan is close to the cooler but not directly mounted on the cooler as is the pulling fan. Do you think it would help to mount it directly too?

So I really hope that the TIM will solve the temp problem.

(The cooler does not feel warm - so I really put my hopes on the pasting).

I hope to get it with the post this week. So I am glad to know, that the mounting is OK and for your advice on how to clean and applicate the TIM.

Thankyou for all the support You have given me already :-)

[gvblake22]

You fan arrangement sounds fine. The only thing you could try changing is the orientation/direction of the case fans. You could try flipping them both so the one on the side panel blows into the case and the one on the back of the case blows out and keep the 80mm fan mounted on the Ninja Mini blowing into the heatsink (not the other way pulling air through).

[Michael]

Thanks again for your advice on the fans. I believe my arrangement is exactly as you describe.

So now I am impatiently waiting for the post to deliver my TIM.

Best regards

Michael

[Michael]

Hi again. By incidence I saw the postman in the area on my way home, after he had tried to deliver - and got my precious TIM :-)

I have cleaned and pasted and I think that helped :-)

On iddle I have 53C coretemp and the motherboard reads 51C and its cool'n'quiet turns the fan down to 1200RPM - and that's pretty quit3.

3DMARK turns the coretemp to 56C and the mobo to 53C and full fanpower which is a litte over 2400 RPM

I can feel that my vga is the most warm - but not to hoot I think (56C) - element in the case. It is a passively cooled GeForce 7600 GT from MSI. So maybe the heat is comming from that. Right now I am experimenting setting its clock frequences at the lowest - and have not yet seen any difference.

As I write the coretemp is 52C and the mobo sais 50C keeping the fan down around 1750 RPM which still is pretty quiet.

So I am very happy with my system now and thank you for all your help.

Michael