[H]ard looks at AMD's triple core

[Capper]

Originally Posted by Telexen

I'm not sure how anyone with rational knowledge of how chips are designed and manufactured can think that it's as simple as just cutting off the defective core and making a 3 core die out of it.

Very, very true

[Yellowhello]

Originally Posted by Telexen

I'm not sure how anyone with rational knowledge of how chips are designed and manufactured can think that it's as simple as just cutting off the defective core and making a 3 core die out of it.

So I guess I have it wrong. I honestly have no idea how they would do it. I do know that it sounds like a great idea (in my mind, if a lot cheaper) though. I've already stated what I think in this discussion, though.

[Telexen]

Originally Posted by Stormcrow

I know in the case of GPU's, with the X1950GT it used the same chip at the X1950XT but with an entire quadrant of the GPU shut down due to pipeline errors or difficulty in scaling to the right clockspeeds. Perhaps the same can be done with a CPU. If it's not scaling to the proper speeds, due to defects or all 4 cores just not wanting to get along, one of the cores is shut down and isolated so that the remaining three can reach a higher and more effective speed.

Can you provide a link to back that up? I'm not looking to start an argument or disprove you or anything, but this entire thread is giving me a headache because the claim doesn't seem to be possible to me.

I don't see how they can "shut down" part of the GPU...they just don't work like that. If they're the same core, it's long been traditional to use the same core in two classes of cards by slowing the memory interface, lowering the clocks, and locking it to lower voltages to slow it down (and then overcharge for the higher class card to make up for the $ they lose ... *cough*)

[Stormcrow]

To be honest, I'm not sure how that would either. With the way the dies are cast, disabling certain parts of the processor itself seems like it would either cause it to underperform or not work at all. Maybe they just meant the pipelines were disabled, I'll see what I can find.

EDIT: The X1950GT is just an underclocked X1950Pro, which has 4 of it's pipelines disabled from the usual 16 of the X1950XT. Since that's 1/4, that answers that about the quadrant situation. Still doesn't explain how AMD can take gimp a quad core into a tri core.

[Telexen]

I can't say that it's entirely impossible ... but it would take a FANCY design and IMO hinder their Quad-core CPUs to be able to disable a single core on a whim. Certainly this wouldn't work for just ANY core when you decide one is defective from contamination.

[Jokerswild]

I just don't see any point in having 3 cores. There's still not a lot of stuff that supports duo cores so whats the point specially when there's quad cores out. If the 3 core has a higher clock than the quad then doesn't the 2 core have a higher clock than the 3 core?

[Capper]

It can be done, but I neither have the time, energy, or resoureces to put together a write up right now....maybe thats something we can do down the road, but it is very possible to disable a bad core, or in the case of a graphics card, disable bad pipelines.

[halutzparilla]

this thread is going to the gutter with conspiracy,

YH you started the conspiracy theory wtg

but kidding aside, the possibility of rendering a part of 4 cores like shutting 1 core off is possible...

[Telexen]

Originally Posted by Jokerswild

I just don't see any point in having 3 cores. There's still not a lot of stuff that supports duo cores so whats the point specially when there's quad cores out. If the 3 core has a higher clock than the quad then doesn't the 2 core have a higher clock than the 3 core?

Here's the other problem I have with this thread.

You don't have to be using applications that are multithreaded to take advantage of multiple cores. There are times you can run several individual threads that will use your full processing power. I've had a quad core system for ~16 months now, and I get great use out of it...it all just depends on your needs.

As far as the need for a 3 core; it's nothing more than marketing. You may have a need to run applications that may utilize two cores well but not the third, yet have another application that needs to run parallel; which would use the third. All this while you may not want to spend the money on a Quad core.

Originally Posted by Capper

It can be done, but I neither have the time, energy, or resoureces to put together a write up right now....maybe thats something we can do down the road, but it is very possible to disable a bad core, or in the case of a graphics card, disable bad pipelines.

Wouldn't this depend on being able to test the die as a whole, as well as the each core individually to find the bad one? To me the equipment to do this would offset the cost advantage of using defective die.

[Stormcrow]

What we have I'm starting to think is the next phase in the Megahertz Wars. Now, instead of clockspeed it'll be cores. Go into Best Buy, or order a OEM computer, and the description lists "more cores means more productive and better performance." We're just starting to see an emergence of dual core optimized programs, so the tri-core will be a selling point. It's third core will basically just sit there. And if someone does run a program supporting quads, then they'll get that extra 1/3 of processing power. When the octos start coming out, does this mean we'll have Quint, Sext, and Sept-cores? Since more cores means more power, the customer buys a tri-core but only gets 2/3's of the performance due to unoptimized instructions and programs supporting only duals for now. But they'll probably never notice, except maybe a placebo effect. Seems like an excellent marketing scheme for bad yields they have to find a way to sell anyway and the average consumer can again base their computer decisions off bigger numbers.

This is all directed towards the average consumer. The tri-core would offer more performance over the dual-core, but to average Joe who can get along fine with a Pentium 4 this is like a great marketing development.